Comments on: Time To Return The Buses To Public Ownership? http://www.aucklandtrains.co.nz/2009/10/11/time-to-return-the-buses-to-public-ownership/ Latest Transport News & Views Fri, 12 Mar 2010 10:35:13 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 By: jarbury http://www.aucklandtrains.co.nz/2009/10/11/time-to-return-the-buses-to-public-ownership/comment-page-1/#comment-1845 jarbury Mon, 12 Oct 2009 08:58:30 +0000 http://www.aucklandtrains.co.nz/?p=6495#comment-1845 The Regional Council can't own buses, but ARTA can. That's how we get away with ARTA owning the trains at the moment. So while the ARC couldn't legally buy back the buses, ARTA could. I just don't think they have $300 million or so lying around, unfortunately. The Regional Council can’t own buses, but ARTA can. That’s how we get away with ARTA owning the trains at the moment.

So while the ARC couldn’t legally buy back the buses, ARTA could. I just don’t think they have $300 million or so lying around, unfortunately.

]]> By: Chris R http://www.aucklandtrains.co.nz/2009/10/11/time-to-return-the-buses-to-public-ownership/comment-page-1/#comment-1816 Chris R Sun, 11 Oct 2009 20:52:44 +0000 http://www.aucklandtrains.co.nz/?p=6495#comment-1816 The company locked out the workers because the workers were going to work to the company rule book! Can Act Supporter please tell me the company should be able to do this? It is the COMPANY rule book - not the union rule book! Dump Infratil! The company locked out the workers because the workers were going to work to the company rule book!

Can Act Supporter please tell me the company should be able to do this? It is the COMPANY rule book – not the union rule book!

Dump Infratil!

]]> By: Stagecoach http://www.aucklandtrains.co.nz/2009/10/11/time-to-return-the-buses-to-public-ownership/comment-page-1/#comment-1813 Stagecoach Sun, 11 Oct 2009 18:21:24 +0000 http://www.aucklandtrains.co.nz/?p=6495#comment-1813 With the move to a reorganised Auckland governance of local body, now is the time to also get this right. It's a shambles. Where is the master plan for buses? Where should they run? Who should run them? What sort of system is right for this age? Should it be a pick up shuttle service - dial in like a taxi as the airport shuttle runs? We need fresh thinking. With the move to a reorganised Auckland governance of local body, now is the time to also get this right.
It’s a shambles. Where is the master plan for buses? Where should they run? Who should run them? What sort of system is right for this age? Should it be a pick up shuttle service – dial in like a taxi as the airport shuttle runs?
We need fresh thinking.

]]> By: KeithN http://www.aucklandtrains.co.nz/2009/10/11/time-to-return-the-buses-to-public-ownership/comment-page-1/#comment-1812 KeithN Sun, 11 Oct 2009 18:17:30 +0000 http://www.aucklandtrains.co.nz/?p=6495#comment-1812 We don't need a return to public ownership. we need a new bus company tender. We need a NZ company that puts people first, not profits. We don’t need a return to public ownership.
we need a new bus company tender. We need a NZ company that puts people first, not profits.

]]> By: bob http://www.aucklandtrains.co.nz/2009/10/11/time-to-return-the-buses-to-public-ownership/comment-page-1/#comment-1810 bob Sun, 11 Oct 2009 13:42:59 +0000 http://www.aucklandtrains.co.nz/?p=6495#comment-1810 YES!!! Public transport should definitely be brought back under public ownership and operation. The private sector has failed dismally time and again to run PT on time and reliably and transparently. And while Veolia has run trains tolerably (except when problems arise, then they can't cope), this should be nationalised too - its pointless having a separate company 'managing' a service that is specified by ARC and run by former NZ Rail staff (passed from NZ Rail to Tranz Rail to Toll Rail to Veolia). What do Veolia do for their share of the cash exactly? But public ownership is not a panacea - recall the publicly owned buses had strikes in the 1980s that hit patronage hard. What public ownership does is give direct democratic control - if MPs and councillors don't keep buses running, we de-elect them next election! Small notes: Puke lad - if you don't let a worker withdraw their labour (ie strike) then you are making that worker your slave. Think about it. Act supporter - sharpen up! Your cliche about a time warp back to the 1950s is rubbish! What about privatised Telecom (today) leaving Northland customers without phones for months? Free market competition hasn't given them reliability - because the Telecom shareholders want more profit. And Kiwirail was a superb nationalisation ruined only by Cullen paying a ludicrous sum of $2/3bn for what was just a few hundred locos and few thousand wagons. Worth maybe $140m or so at best. Jon - if the buses were nationalised (or regionised if owned by ARC) quickly, we could save tens of millions in ARC rates about to be wasted creating an integrated ticketing system that isn't required under a public monopoly. But let's learn the lesson of Kiwirail, and not pay for the buses when they are taken back, until we get the Infratil/NZ Bus books open and carefully scrutinised for true market value of their buses. YES!!! Public transport should definitely be brought back under public ownership and operation. The private sector has failed dismally time and again to run PT on time and reliably and transparently.

And while Veolia has run trains tolerably (except when problems arise, then they can’t cope), this should be nationalised too – its pointless having a separate company ‘managing’ a service that is specified by ARC and run by former NZ Rail staff (passed from NZ Rail to Tranz Rail to Toll Rail to Veolia). What do Veolia do for their share of the cash exactly?

But public ownership is not a panacea – recall the publicly owned buses had strikes in the 1980s that hit patronage hard. What public ownership does is give direct democratic control – if MPs and councillors don’t keep buses running, we de-elect them next election!

Small notes:
Puke lad – if you don’t let a worker withdraw their labour (ie strike) then you are making that worker your slave. Think about it.

Act supporter – sharpen up! Your cliche about a time warp back to the 1950s is rubbish! What about privatised Telecom (today) leaving Northland customers without phones for months? Free market competition hasn’t given them reliability – because the Telecom shareholders want more profit.

And Kiwirail was a superb nationalisation ruined only by Cullen paying a ludicrous sum of $2/3bn for what was just a few hundred locos and few thousand wagons. Worth maybe $140m or so at best.

Jon – if the buses were nationalised (or regionised if owned by ARC) quickly, we could save tens of millions in ARC rates about to be wasted creating an integrated ticketing system that isn’t required under a public monopoly.

But let’s learn the lesson of Kiwirail, and not pay for the buses when they are taken back, until we get the Infratil/NZ Bus books open and carefully scrutinised for true market value of their buses.

]]> By: Worried http://www.aucklandtrains.co.nz/2009/10/11/time-to-return-the-buses-to-public-ownership/comment-page-1/#comment-1808 Worried Sun, 11 Oct 2009 11:08:08 +0000 http://www.aucklandtrains.co.nz/?p=6495#comment-1808 It's not a return to the old days. Governments and leadership have changed. We don't have the bureaucracies and Stalinist rule from Wellington the country once did. nor should we still be having the bosses versus workers situation we seem to be having in this wage dispute. If a wage issue can't be resolved after five months and lead to a lockout, it's time to hope for government action to get the essential service of public transport moving again. I thought we were done with old style waterfront disputes. It’s not a return to the old days.
Governments and leadership have changed. We don’t have the bureaucracies and Stalinist rule from Wellington the country once did.
nor should we still be having the bosses versus workers situation we seem to be having in this wage dispute.
If a wage issue can’t be resolved after five months and lead to a lockout, it’s time to hope for government action to get the essential service of public transport moving again.
I thought we were done with old style waterfront disputes.

]]> By: ACT Supporter http://www.aucklandtrains.co.nz/2009/10/11/time-to-return-the-buses-to-public-ownership/comment-page-1/#comment-1807 ACT Supporter Sun, 11 Oct 2009 10:58:45 +0000 http://www.aucklandtrains.co.nz/?p=6495#comment-1807 This is an over reaction. The union threatened work to rule and the company, as it's entitled to do, reacted by locking them out as it could not guarantee it could run its operation successfully going forward. This is what businesses have to do in order to secure their business for their shareholders. We are not going back to the 50s. What next? Sell Telecom back to the government and resurrect a post and telegraph department where you wait months for a phone to be installed? Look at the mess Labour has got us into by buying back Kiwirail which will be a massive drain on taxpayers for decades as buying back the bus service would be. The governments today should not be in the business of running or even subsidising such services. This is an over reaction. The union threatened work to rule and the company, as it’s entitled to do, reacted by locking them out as it could not guarantee it could run its operation successfully going forward. This is what businesses have to do in order to secure their business for their shareholders.
We are not going back to the 50s. What next? Sell Telecom back to the government and resurrect a post and telegraph department where you wait months for a phone to be installed?
Look at the mess Labour has got us into by buying back Kiwirail which will be a massive drain on taxpayers for decades as buying back the bus service would be.
The governments today should not be in the business of running or even subsidising such services.

]]> By: Pukekohe lad http://www.aucklandtrains.co.nz/2009/10/11/time-to-return-the-buses-to-public-ownership/comment-page-1/#comment-1806 Pukekohe lad Sun, 11 Oct 2009 10:54:33 +0000 http://www.aucklandtrains.co.nz/?p=6495#comment-1806 Here in sth auckland, we are badly hit with this ridiculous strike. OK if you just go to Queen St by train or Newmarket but many of us work cross-town these days which is the way Auckland lives. The world doesnt end at the bottom of Queen St. The strike shouldnt be allowed and the company should lose the right to run the buses. Here in sth auckland, we are badly hit with this ridiculous strike. OK if you just go to Queen St by train or Newmarket but many of us work cross-town these days which is the way Auckland lives. The world doesnt end at the bottom of Queen St.
The strike shouldnt be allowed and the company should lose the right to run the buses.

]]> By: Sarah http://www.aucklandtrains.co.nz/2009/10/11/time-to-return-the-buses-to-public-ownership/comment-page-1/#comment-1805 Sarah Sun, 11 Oct 2009 10:52:24 +0000 http://www.aucklandtrains.co.nz/?p=6495#comment-1805 The regional council and especially Mr Lee has shown they can make a difference - thanks for to their efforts, we have a train service of sorts and plans for it to get better. Look at all the development going on. Wouldn't it be great if they could weave that magic for the buses? The regional council and especially Mr Lee has shown they can make a difference – thanks for to their efforts, we have a train service of sorts and plans for it to get better. Look at all the development going on.
Wouldn’t it be great if they could weave that magic for the buses?

]]> By: Frustrated http://www.aucklandtrains.co.nz/2009/10/11/time-to-return-the-buses-to-public-ownership/comment-page-1/#comment-1804 Frustrated Sun, 11 Oct 2009 10:50:29 +0000 http://www.aucklandtrains.co.nz/?p=6495#comment-1804 It feels like the bus company is trying to break the union in half. if that's the bully boy tactics being used, it's time to bring ownership at least back into NZ companies or as suggested back to public ownership. It feels like the bus company is trying to break the union in half. if that’s the bully boy tactics being used, it’s time to bring ownership at least back into NZ companies or as suggested back to public ownership.

]]> By: David http://www.aucklandtrains.co.nz/2009/10/11/time-to-return-the-buses-to-public-ownership/comment-page-1/#comment-1800 David Sun, 11 Oct 2009 09:08:42 +0000 http://www.aucklandtrains.co.nz/?p=6495#comment-1800 Im not sure when I stumbled upon this blog but just writing to say you're doing a great job writing the blog and updating it and such. I subscribe to the RSS feed through Google Reader. Ive lived in Auckland all my life, and Ive only used the trains a few times(its been a good experience when I have) though I can fully understand why people would get frustrated with the services. I use the bus mostly, and since I have lived near main roads the bus services(274, Link) have generally been really good. Im a fan of public transport, and have only had generally positive experiences with it. When ive visited Sydney Ive been amazed by the speed and capacity of their trains and services, so its kind of ironic that Sydney is also fretting about their metro system: http://www.smh.com.au/national/transport Hopefully this unrequested praise has made your day. Im not sure when I stumbled upon this blog but just writing to say you’re doing a great job writing the blog and updating it and such. I subscribe to the RSS feed through Google Reader.

Ive lived in Auckland all my life, and Ive only used the trains a few times(its been a good experience when I have) though I can fully understand why people would get frustrated with the services.

I use the bus mostly, and since I have lived near main roads the bus services(274, Link) have generally been really good. Im a fan of public transport, and have only had generally positive experiences with it.

When ive visited Sydney Ive been amazed by the speed and capacity of their trains and services, so its kind of ironic that Sydney is also fretting about their metro system:

http://www.smh.com.au/national/transport

Hopefully this unrequested praise has made your day.

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